SBP Premiums With Deposits for CRSC, CRDP, and Military Pensions


 

Whether you’re medically or physically retired for disability before 20 years of service, have you checked your eligibility for Combat Related Special Compensation?

If you’re retired with at least 20 years of service (whatever military pension you’ve earned) are you receiving Concurrent Retirement and Disability Pay? *

Here’s an example of how complicated this military retirement documentation can get. Even when you’re already financially independent, it still affects your income taxes.

And yeah, I’ve crammed a few obscure acronyms into the title of this blog post. I’ve decrypted them in the text below, but please let me know if you have questions on their details.

A reader writes:

I’m seeking clarity to ensure my SBP premium is still paid since opting to elect CRSC pay over Air Force retirement pay. (This was more beneficial financially, and tax exempt.) This was the response from Ask DFAS yesterday, are you able to help gain clarity on this? Does this mean my VA pay is diminished by the amount listed, plus some from CRSC?
“Because you are in receipt of a VA entitlement that is less than your military retired pay, we have to deduct the VA waiver which is less than your retired pay gross. The remaining amount after offset is $272.09 and that is applied to part of your SBP premium which is $280.72. So, the remaining $8.63 is withheld from your combat related special compensation.”
Mainly, I’m just trying to find out where that $280.72 is being offset from – my VA pay? My retirement pay? Or otherwise? Thank you!

—————

If it’s any consolation, DFAS’s response confused me too.  It’s not my first time that’s happened, and it won’t be my last.

The Defense Finance Accounting Service is deducting your entitlements to pay the premium on your Survivor Benefit Plan, so you know that your premium is still being paid.

Screenshot of a typical U.S. military electronic Retiree Account Statement showing deposits for gross pay, VA disability compensation, and Survivor Benefits Plan premiums. In this case there are no SBP elections, so no premiums. | MilitaryFinancialIndependence.com

Screenshot of a typical eRAS.

The rest of the answers that I’m giving below should be documented in your DFAS Retiree Account Statement (on myPay) and in your bank’s monthly checking account statement. I’ll get into those statements after writing about the background.

 

Background:

A federal dual-compensation law from the 1950s restricts the simultaneous receipt of military pensions and VA disability compensation.

To comply with that law, vets who receive an active-duty or Reserve pension can choose to have their (taxable) military pension offset by (tax-exempt) VA disability compensation. It leaves you with the same total amount of monthly deposits, yet lower income taxes.

Congress has spent at least the last 40 years (that I’m aware of) chipping away at the dual-compensation law without actually eliminating it. Combat Related Special Compensation is one of the workarounds to “offset the offset” by restoring some of the pension that you gave up to receive VA disability compensation.

Here’s a frequent question on the DFAS website, and this is a verbatim quote:

“Q: What happens to my Retired Pay if I switch to CRSC?
A: If you elect to receive CRSC, your retired pay will be offset by the full amount of your VA disability pay. You may still receive some retired pay if your retired pay exceeds your VA disability pay.
[…]
CRSC payments are subject to deductions for monthly SBP premiums or garnishments.
Also, CRSC is non-taxable, so it is issued separately from your retired pay. You may begin to receive two separate payments from DFAS each month, one for retired pay (taxable) and one for CRSC (non-taxable).

[Sidebar: Retirement pay is generally taxable. The VA’s CRSC and disability compensation are tax-exempt. However both DFAS and the VA frequently use the word “pay” as an equivalent term for “compensation.”  This annoys tax accountants– and confuses many military families who are trying to figure out their benefits.]

 

Stacking up the statements:

Here’s how your CRSC was initially implemented by DFAS:
You’re receiving your pension (reduced by the offset for VA disability compensation), plus your CRSC (to compensate for the reduced pension), and plus your VA disability compensation. Your Retiree Account Statement on myPay could show:
+ Pension
– the offset VA disability compensation,
+ CRSC,
+ VA disability compensation.
This is listed in the Pay Item Description portion of the RAS with terms like “gross pay”, CRSC, and “VA waiver”. The SBP Coverage part of the RAS shows the SBP premium.

SBP premiums that are paid from your pension are also not taxed. For tax accounting purposes this is (even more) complicated by paying your SBP premiums as a deduction from your pension and compensation.  SBP premiums are the very first deduction from your pension– before taxes– in order to reduce the pension’s taxable amount.

This complicates the DFAS calculation:
+ [Pension – VA disability compensation] = $272.09,
– [SBP $272.09 premium] of your total $280.72 SBP premium,
+ CRSC, then
– [SBP remaining $8.63 premium], and finally
+ VA disability compensation.

Screenshot of a checking account showing two electronic deposits from the Defense Finance Accounting Service, with one for retirement pay and the other one from the VA (through DFAS) for disability compensation. | MilitaryFinancialIndependence.com

DFAS and VA deposits in a checking account.

The VA uses a different financial account than DoD for their deposits, although that deposit also comes through DFAS.

Your checking account statement should show at least two deposits each month: CRSC and VA disability compensation. If your pension was bigger than your SBP premium then you’d see three deposits.

You could track your (taxable) pension income on your Retiree Account Statement, and you’d also see that income on your annual Internal Revenue Service Form 1099-R pension distribution summary. However your pension is wiped out by your SBP premiums, so you have no net pension income. I doubt that DFAS would issue a 1099-R full of zeroes, and we already know that VA disability compensation & CRSC are never reported to the IRS.

Keep in mind that your military pension, your VA disability compensation, and your CRSC all have an annual Cost-Of-Living Adjustment. (It’s the same Consumer Price Index algorithm as the Social Security COLA.) Your SBP premium is a percentage of your pension, so it also rises each year. Your SBP annuity is paid up when you’ve reached age 70 and made at least 360 monthly payments– whichever takes longer.

* Note that the CRDP name was changed in February 2026. The July 2025 update to the Financial Management Regulation (DoD 7000.14-R) was changed to “Concurrent Military Retirement Pay and Department of Veterans Affairs (DVA) Disability Compensation”, followed by the actual change (in 2026) to Volume 7B Chapter 64. Apparently we don’t have an acronym for that yet: “CMRPD&DVADC’…?

 

Call To Action:

– If you’re a military retiree, then check your monthly Retiree Account Statement whenever you change something.

– It’s a good idea to check your RAS every month, but at a minimum you should check the December RAS to see how your pension & VA disability compensation will change next year.

– If you’re not retired yet, then make sure you’ve downloaded all of your Leave and Earnings Statements before you separate! Your myPay or MarineOnLine account might shut down your LES access after you leave the service.

 

 

 

There are no affiliate links or paid ads in this post.  Try your military base library or local public library before you pay money for these books– in any format.

 

Military Financial Independence on Amazon:

The Military Guide cover
  • Reach your own financial independence
  • Retire on your terms
  • Success stories and personal checklists
  • Royalties donated to military charities

Use this link to order from Amazon.com!

Raising Your Money-Savvy Family on Amazon:

The Money-Savvy Family cover
  • Reach your own financial independence
  • Teach your kids how to manage their money
  • Specific tactics from my adult daughter
  • Checklists and spreadsheets for your family

Use this link to order from Amazon.com!

 

 

Related articles:
Why You File Your Veterans Disability Claim (Not Just How)
Family Estate Planning For Your Disability
This is why we blog: another “net disability exclusion” story
VA Disability Compensation Withholding, Offset, & Recoupment
CRDP vs CRSC: Getting Back the Retired Pay the VA Waiver Takes
How VA Disability Compensation Affects Military Retirement Pay
Why Some Disabled Veterans Can’t Get Both VA Disability and Military Retirement Pay
CRSC and CRDP Military Retirement Pays and How to Get Them

Posted in Insurance, Military and Veterans Benefits, Money Management & Personal Finance | Leave a comment

40 years of danger: military specialty pay + bonus contracts


While you’re pursuing your path to financial independence: are you ever tempted by the military’s specialty pay or bonus programs?

One of our family’s (many) military-retention discussions reminded me of a sea story behind our financial independence.

I was certainly tempted from the day I joined: all the way back in 1978 when we midshipmen could get extra liberty by donating blood. (Not that much extra liberty— we were still limited to one pint every eight weeks.) For the next two decades of my service I was constantly pelted by offers of submarine pay, sea pay, nuclear bonus pay, and even “free” college degrees.

Note: I am not a member of any service’s Command Retention Team.

Image of large messy pile of one-hundred-dollar and fifty-dollar bills for military specialty pay or bonus contracts. | MilitaryFinancialIndependence.com

Is it enough yet?

Which brings me to my next point: have you ever wondered why the military is being extra nice to some of us? Shouldn’t we already be compensated well enough (with benefits and entitlements as well as pay) that our services wouldn’t have to dangle more retention carrots in front of us?

Today this bonus & retention topic is still perpetually relevant among military families, especially with one servicemember who I’ve known for years.

They’ve been on active duty over a decade, and they’re already financially independent. However (in their ideal world) they would personally prefer to earn a military pension without sacrificing their family’s quality of life.

Their feeling persists even after paying the price for their highly successful tour in an all-consuming career-enhancing 24/7 operations billet. They’ve transferred (with a great performance report and a medal) to a new command and they’ve leveled up to greater responsibility.  Fortunately they’re recovering from burnout, and their work/life balance is improving.

Yet similar to the slow-boiled frog, even this scorched servicemember was briefly tempted by the possibility of signing up for more active duty. I see my role in our discussions as mentoring and facilitating their Reserve transition on their terms. They’re considering that move to the Reserves in another 12-24 months, and we’ll keep talking about it.

 

The Sea Story:  40 years ago.

In 1986 the Cold War had reached a new peak. The Soviet Union was castigated as the Evil Empire while America worked on a new shield against ballistic missiles. (The Strategic Defense Initiative was cleverly marketed as “Star Wars” to tie in with the Return Of The Jedi movie.) Today’s historians have documented that Moscow’s 1980s leadership was seriously concerned about a preemptive nuclear strike, and they expected it to come from the U.S. Navy’s ballistic missile submarines.

America was building a 600-ship Navy, and the new OHIO-class submarines were launching from the shipyards. With our existing 41 SSBNs and another 50+ attack submarines, our new Navy required over 1500 nuclear-trained submarine officers. Now we had to figure out how to recruit— and retain— those steely-eyed killers of the deep.

Image of Doug Nordman learning SCUBA diving in Monterey Bay when he's supposed to be studying hard at Naval Postgraduate School. | MilitaryFinancialIndependence.com

Studying hard!

Back then I was finishing my junior officer nuclear-engineering tour on my first submarine. I was very much ready for shore duty, and I could have left active duty at my five-year mark of June 1987.  Instead I’d requested orders to the Naval Postgraduate School in Monterey, CA to be stationed with my spouse! We’d just married (after four years of doing distance) and we were among the Navy’s newest dual-military couples. At NPS she’d earn her oceanography & meteorology graduate degrees and I’d earn mine in weapons engineering. (Of course our highest priority was enjoying a lot of each other with quality liberty time around and in Monterey Bay.)

During this tour we’d also pick up our new service obligations– mine would be four more years after NPS. After graduation I’d go straight back to submarine sea duty as a department head and follow up with yet another shore tour.

A few months before I obligated for those NPS orders, the Navy rolled out a new nuclear-power bonus program.  As nuclear-qualified officers finished their initial obligation, they could start a contract for an additional 3-5 years. Each year of that contract was worth $10K, paid at the start of the year. (That’s $30K in 2026 dollars, although in 2026 the current submarine bonus contract pays $40K-$45K/year). The 1980s bonus was a big improvement over a 1970s bonus program (which had been savaged by stagflation), and we lieutenants were all excited about the opportunities.

The fine print of the new program even included an “annual incentive” bonus for those who’d finished their initial obligation of five years of active duty. If we didn’t want to obligate up front for $10K/year over the life of the contract, then at each anniversary after our commissioning obligation we were still eligible for a smaller $7200 bonus (over $21K in 2026 dollars) just for sticking around to finish the year.

I guess BUPERS wanted to let us switch between bonus contracts and annual incentives to optimize our retention while we kept earning the big (or bigger) bucks.

 

The problem.

In early 1987, as I was about to apply for my bonus contract, BUPERS sent one of the assignment officers to Monterey to meet with us nuclear-trained students. It turned out that Naval Reactors had intended for the contract’s service obligation to be served concurrent with other service obligations (for example, graduate degrees from NPS)— but the BUPERS legal staff had recently concluded that the Congressional legislation implied consecutive obligations.

BUPERS had put out incorrect information and inadvertently let us sign contracts that didn’t comply with the federal law.

A few months earlier, one of my classmates (we’ll call him “Rick”) had signed up for what he thought were concurrent 4-year NPS and 5-year bonus obligations. He was the first to be told that he was now expected to stay on active duty for nine more years after NPS— effectively serving a grand total of 16 years of active duty. I don’t know what Rick said to his assignment officer, but BUPERS had already approved a bunch of contracts with nukes who were now arriving at NPS. Rick was persuasive enough for BUPERS to send their submarine representative out to Monterey to negotiate a solution.

When the assignment officer entered the auditorium, he was facing a hostile audience of at least two dozen O-3s and a few O-4s. All of us had already incurred a new service obligation by starting our NPS tours. Like Rick, a few had signed a nuclear bonus contract before reporting to NPS and were not happy about their new consecutive obligations. A few of us had planned to sign nuclear bonus contracts, but now we wanted to get the facts.

Have you ever wanted to get your assignment officer alone in a room with your peers (no senior leaders!), where you could just speak truth to power? Yeah. This time we had an entire platoon of people who wanted to speak a lot of truth.

Fortunately for the nuclear-power assignment officers, BUPERS had already figured out the right answers. Nobody on that staff (least of all the admiral) wanted to see this controversy discussed on the front pages of Navy Times. After the assignment officer spent 15 minutes describing “how we got here”, he was ready to make a deal.

His first offer was to let any of us who wanted to leave NPS (without incurring an obligation) as long as we quit this week.

Ha-ha! Yeah right. A few years ago he’d served his own tour at NPS, and he already knew none of us would take that deal. Besides, if we left NPS right now then we’d go right back to sea duty— especially if the bonus contract was our only reason to leave. Back-to-back sea tours didn’t hold much appeal, especially when all you had to do at NPS shore duty was publish your thesis.

He paused for questions. As everyone expected, nobody took him up on his first offer. We moved on.

His second offer was to let anyone out of their bonus contract that day— right now— even if they’d already signed one.

We all knew we’d have an NPS obligation anyway, and BUPERS was all right with canceling our contracts. He pointed out that instead of getting $10K up front in each year of a contract, we’d still get $7200 at the end of the year. The catch was that we’d have to serve our NPS obligation before we could sign any nuclear bonus contracts. The $7200/year consolation prize would last through NPS and for at least 3-4 years after graduation before we were free to sign up for a bigger bonus. That’s assuming we even wanted to continue on active duty in the first place, let alone commit for a bonus.

Oh, and if we’d already received a $10K tranche from the bonus contract, then we’d have to give back $2800. BUPERS knew we’d stick around long enough to earn the $7200 and they weren’t going to quibble over the timing. They’d even helpfully deduct the $2800 from our pay.

As you might imagine, there was some grumbling over this offer. People who’d already accepted orders to NPS and then also signed a bonus contract had felt seen and validated by the career boost. The Navy had finally acknowledged their value with a twofer of serving simultaneous obligations, and now that could be revoked by a legal technicality.

Federal convicts got concurrent prison sentences and credit for time served, right? Then why not us nukes?

As the grumbling spread through the audience, the assignment officer played his ace card: “But wait, there’s more!”

 

The BUPERS solution:

He shared that the BUPERS lawyers and the Congressional liaisons had worked out a proposal for corrective legislation. The existing nuclear-bonus law would be amended to specify “concurrent” instead of the default “consecutive”, and the Navy policy directives would be updated to match the new legal language.

This would make us nukes happy, it would make BUPERS’ lawyers happy, and our higher retention rate would make Congress happy. We still needed to win the Cold War! Legislators would take a quick voice vote during the current session, and BUPERS would handle the rest of the details.

It also made the assignment officer happy.  He was confident this correction would happen in a matter of days… but now there was another catch.

The only people at NPS who’d benefit from Congress changing the law to “concurrent” were the officers who’d already signed a bonus contract. After Congress clarified the law, the officers who were already under another obligation (like NPS) but had not signed the bonus contract would be locked out of it until they’d served their existing obligation.

Admittedly we were still eligible for the $7200 annual retention incentive while we served off our NPS obligation. Yet this $2800/year difference would sting if we passed up the bonus contract and then watched Congress pass the corrective legislation.

The assignment officer’s next words: “We need to know the headcount for tomorrow’s meeting with the admiral. If you want to sign a bonus contract for a concurrent obligation, you have to act today or get locked out!” He’d brought a stack of blank contracts for us to fill in— at that very moment— and he was leaving on the next flight back to BUPERS.

A hush fell over the group. We could all do the math, and the corrective-legislation tactic seemed straightforward.

The room exploded with happiness, and a crowd stampeded to the front to fill out their contracts.

 

“How Could This Possibly Go Bad?!?”

All the way from our back row, another officer raised his hand. We’ll call him “Steve.”

Steve: “Sir, what happens if we sign a contract and the corrective legislation isn’t approved this session? Will our obligations still stay consecutive?”
Assignment officer: “Well, sure, I guess that could happen. But this corrective legislation is a done deal and Congress is just waiting for us to bring them the paperwork for the voice vote.
Anyone have any other questions? No? Then sign here please.”

I turned in my seat and locked eyes with Steve. We acknowledged our mutual skepticism. A few more of us gathered in the back to pessimistically assess the likelihood of a failure of the corrective legislation. We’d already seen some “sure things” in the fleet which had mutated into failures, and we were wary of the assignment officer’s smooth delivery with his time pressure.

The assignment officer (probably) wasn’t evil, but he was a trained sales professional. To us, it was personal. To him, it was just business.

This time (unlike The Godfather movie’s platitudes), we had the choice of refusing an offer. While the eager crowd at the front finished filling out their contracts and signing them, our small group of skeptics quietly left the room.

And yes, I already felt the impending sting of giving up the extra $2800/year.

I shared the news with my spouse.  Seeing the horrified look on her face, I assured her that I’d decided to pass by this “opportunity.” We both wanted to be stationed together, but we also wanted to (someday) leave the Navy together. I didn’t need to add my new obligation drama to our new marriage.

You military servicemembers & veterans can already predict how this story ends:

  • Congress tabled the submarine force’s corrective legislation that month.
  • They deferred a vote on it for the rest of their session.
  • Subsequent Congresses ignored it and never approved it.

Over a decade later (coincidentally after all of the consecutive obligations had run their course), the Navy rolled out a new nuclear bonus contract that clearly specified “concurrent.”

By then Rick had finished his consecutive obligations and could sign a contract for a little more money. He did very well in the rest of his career, and he probably would have stayed on active duty even without a bonus.

I don’t know how Steve’s Navy career turned out, but for the rest of his time at NPS he got free adult beverages from us grateful fellow nukes who didn’t sign a contract. Ironically, after the military he became a lawyer. Maybe it was his skeptical ability to ask the unlikely questions… or maybe he just wanted to have fun with his GI Bill.

My harsh experience convinced me (and my spouse) that we were the only people who could truly manage our careers.

It also accelerated our journey to financial independence. We invested all of my submarine pay and every one of those $7200 annual retention bonuses. We weren’t interested in owning a big house (let alone big pickup trucks), but when we finished our NPS obligations we wanted to have a big transition fund… just in case.

Today (four decades later) when I talk about financial independence with military families, I start by announcing “I am not a member of the Command Retention Team.” After that reassuring disclaimer, I share how to reach FI while you’re still on active duty— even if you don’t earn a pension. And especially even if you don’t earn any specialty pay or bonuses.

I’m also writing about retention from my military-family perspective: as dual-military parents, we watched our daughter join the Navy (“Free scholarship!!”) and later marry another Navy officer. (“The new family business.”) We raised a money-savvy family and it all worked out well, but she certainly surprised us with her career choice.

As grandparents, my spouse and I are carefully watching for that fateful day (in 2037 or so) when our six-year-old granddaughter announces: “Mom, Dad, I’m joining the Space Force.”

 

Call To Action:

40 years later, the systems are just as dangerous.  Make sure your money motives are aligned with your values, not just with your wallet.

Please give yourself permission to stay on active duty as long as you’re feeling challenged & fulfilled. You’re part of something bigger than yourself. You’re supporting the mission and taking care of your people. If you’re internally motivated by your service then feel free to accept all of the additional specialty pay and bonuses— but take it one obligation at a time and be ready to leave active duty at every exit ramp.

If you’re in the Blended Retirement System, are you taking the Continuation Pay contract for an additional four years of service? Is the extra cash worth your life energy?  Or would you prefer to have more flexibility over your career choices between 12-16 years? And yes, that service obligation is also supposed to be concurrent.

While you’re on active duty, have you considered transferring your GI Bill eligibility to your spouse or kids for an additional service obligation? It’s supposed to be concurrent with other obligations— but make sure that your community is not an exception to that benefit.

Frankly, if you’re pursuing a bridge career after the military, then maybe it makes sense to keep the GI Bill for yourself and skip the service obligation. Your advanced degree or certifications could help you earn more than enough extra compensation in your bridge career to pay for your entire family’s educations.

When the fun stops during active duty, do not be tempted by the finances of a retention contract—let alone gutting it out to 20.

If your internal motivation is vaporizing, then the external motivation is unsustainable. Even worse, you’re risking your health and your family’s quality of life. While the specialty pay & bonus money is awfully attractive at the moment, in the longer term your human capital will get you to your financial independence on your terms.

And if your service or your community is being extra-special-nice to you in exchange for your contractual obligation, then ask yourself: “Why?”

When you’re financially responsible (and already on the path to financial independence) then you don’t have to be seduced by financial retention blandishments.

Teach your money-savvy family about the rewards (and risks) of financial incentives.  Help them make sure they’re not motivated solely by the money.

And be mindful of a teen’s selective hearing when you share your space sea stories with your impressionable youngsters.

 

 

 

 

There are no affiliate links or paid ads in this post.  Try your military base library or local public library before you pay money for these books– in any format.

 

Military Financial Independence on Amazon:

The Military Guide cover
  • Reach your own financial independence
  • Retire on your terms
  • Success stories and personal checklists
  • Royalties donated to military charities

Use this link to order from Amazon.com!

Raising Your Money-Savvy Family on Amazon:

The Money-Savvy Family cover
  • Reach your own financial independence
  • Teach your kids how to manage their money
  • Specific tactics from my adult daughter
  • Checklists and spreadsheets for your family

Use this link to order from Amazon.com!

 

Related articles:
Don’t Gut It Out To 20
“Why Do I Have To Pay Back VSI or SSB?”
Finding Your Military Work-Life Balance

Posted in Career, Financial Independence, Military and Veterans Benefits, Military Life & Family, Military Retirement, Money Management & Personal Finance, Sea Stories | Leave a comment

The Lump-Sum Pension of the Blended Retirement System Is A Payday Loan.


 

When you’re saving and investing aggressively for financial independence, it’s possible to reach FI in less than 20 years— even when you don’t earn any sort of military pension or VA disability compensation.

However life comes at us fast, and many of us started our military careers with less financial literacy than others. If you’re just starting to walk the path to financial independence in your 30s or 40s, it’s easy to feel that you’re too far behind to catch up.

Image of JL Collins' international bestselling book "The Simple Path To Wealth" | MilitaryFinancialIndependence.com

The Simple Lane to FI.

Even worse, when you’re carrying consumer debt then you’re more susceptible to seeking a fast lane to FI. (Pro tip: there is no fast lane to FI.)

In 2018 when the Blended Retirement System started, servicemembers with less than 12 years of service could opt in. That choice was hotly debated at the time, but eight years later we’re starting to see the first cohort of BRS pensions.

BRS retirees are also eyeing the lump sum option. For example:

“I’m retiring at 20 years under BRS and weighing the lump-sum option. Does anyone know how much it would reduce my monthly retirement pay until age 67, and roughly how much the lump-sum offer would be? For those who’ve already gone through this decision, would you still take the lump sum at that reduction, or would you pass and keep the full monthly check? Interested in hearing others’ thoughts and experiences.”

and

“I am taking 25% lump sum of my retirement, the current discounted value is at 6.46%. I should receive around $76,000ish before taxes and will still get $1,442.30 a month for my military pension. Even with having them take out 22% tax for federal I will pocket around $59,000ish. I plan to use this to pay down debt, cover some living expenses and the rest I will put into a high yield savings account.”

From the title of this post, you may suspect that I could be biased. However I also appreciate the power of a hand up, not just a handout. You’d want to make an informed choice on this opportunity to shed crippling high-interest debt, or to start a business, or to simply optimize your FI math for greater wealth.

Let’s look at the pros and cons of a BRS lump sum.

 

Con #1: The Discount Rate

Image of military ID dogtags on top of a pile of U.S. currency as an example of a military payday loan. | MilitaryFinancialIndependence.com

What’s your cost?

Financially & mathematically, the BRS lump sum sucks. Lobbyists of the financial industry have persuaded Congress to grant DoD a license as the nation’s largest payday lender.

The DoD fact sheet for the BRS lump sum specifies an annual discount rate for retirees. As of this writing (May 2026), the discount rate is currently 6.46%. The next annual discount rate will be announced in June:

“According to the published formula, the Lump Sum Discount Rate (LSDR) for lump-sum elections occurring in calendar year 2025 is 6.46 percent, as calculated by the DoD Office of the Actuary. This rate is in effect for any retirement for which a member is eligible to begin receiving retired pay during the period from January 1, 2026, through December 31, 2026.
The next update to the LSDR will be published in June 2026 to be applied to lump-sum elections occurring in calendar year 2027.”

You can analyze this with your own spreadsheet from:

  • your High Three pay base (average of your highest 36 months of base pay),
  • your age at retirement, and
  • the discount rate.

You can also use CFP Daniel Kopp’s Google Sheet template to “File | Make a copy” or download a copy of the spreadsheet to your system, and then edit it with your numbers.

Here’s where the emotions of behavioral financial psychology begin to kick in.

We humans would always rather have money today than wait until tomorrow. The discount rate estimates how much we’re willing to pay *right now* to have that Tomorrow Money (at its future value).

A lot of analysis went into that discount rate. On the other side of this lump-sum offer, the Dept of Defense has platoons of actuaries who know far more math & logic than most of us have ever studied. They’re experienced in estimating risk and at predicting how many millions of dollars they’d have to pay out *now* for people who are eager to make a deal.

If you’re retiring from active duty in your late 30s or early 40s, which side of this contract do you think is more likely to benefit from you giving up 25-30 years of a portion of your pension payments? The DoD side or your side?

If you were applying for a 30-year mortgage, would you be happy with an interest rate of 6.46%?

 

Con #2: The Debt Trap

“But Nords, I can use the lump sum to pay down debt! Right?”

Ah, we’ve seen that movie before.

Some of us are old enough to remember the 2001-17 era of the Career Status Bonus of the REDUX pension system.

This was a $30K lump sum paid out at 15 years of service in return for a reduced pension (unless you stayed for 30 years) with a reduced Cost Of Living Adjustment. Part of the REDUX/CSB pension math is a reset at age 62, where the smaller pension (with a smaller COLA) is reset to a larger High Three pension (but still with a smaller COLA). You can find more details (and reader comments) at this REDUX/CSB post from the archives.

Most of the CSB retirees received their $30K, paid about 22% federal income tax on that bonus, and essentially gave up $100K over the next two decades.  One study estimated that lifetime pension income was reduced by $370K.

I’m sure some retirees needed the CSB help to clear their credit-card debt.  This assumed that they changed their behavior to avoid getting into more consumer debt ever again. Maybe some of them wanted to use the bonus for a down payment on their next home. I’m sure that others expected to make more money in the stock market (or cryptocurrency!) than they’d give up in pension.

I’m convinced that way too much of the bonus money went into awesome pickup trucks. Especially if someone thought they needed that pickup truck for their contractor bridge career.

Years later, I’m getting another round of questions from those REDUX/CSB retirees. They’re approaching their 60s, and they want to know how much their new pension will be. When we do that calculation, we can also figure out their discount rate.

After dozens of e-mails, not one of them has said “Thanks DoD, this was a great deal!”

If those CSB/REDUX pensioners were retiring today with what they know now, I suspect they’d all decline a lump sum.

 

Con #3: “This Time It’s Different.”

Yes, BRS is a different lump-sum offer than CSB/REDUX, but not in a good way. And not only is the math tilted against people who are tempted by the money– it appeals even more strongly to our emotions.

Not only are you borrowing from your pension at 6.46% until age 67, but you’re also doing the following:

  1. Potentially paying higher income taxes today (federal, state, locality) on a lump sum instead of in your income-tax bracket of your full BRS pension… even if you elect to take the lump sum over four years.
  2. Giving back some of the lump sum to the IRS/Treasury for months as estimated tax withholding. DFAS will withhold an estimated amount of the tax you’ll owe, and you’ll have to figure out your own refund when you file your next income-tax return.
  3. Giving up tax-exempt VA disability compensation (for a disability rating of less than 50%) until you would have received that amount of the lump sum pension in VA disability compensation. See the link below.

The zinger on VA disability compensation is in Section 7.a.(3)(h)(1) of the policy document.

“1. Per Section 633 of P.L. 114-92, which amended Section 5304 of Title 38, U.S.C., the VA will withhold disability payments to any retiree who elects to receive a portion of their retired pay as a lump sum until the amount withheld (i.e., not paid to the retiree on a monthly basis) equals the gross amount of the lump sum payment received by that retiree.”

Be aware that if you’re divorced any time before age 67, the full amount of your pension is still subject to division under the Uniformed Services Former Spouses Protection Act. In other words, the state divorce court can assume that you’re currently receiving your full pension even if you took a lump sum. Your ex-spouse’s lawyer will certainly exploit that clause of the BRS to the fullest extent of the law.

 

Pro #1: You Have A Choice.

From the emotions of behavioral financial psychology, you’d want to ask yourself these questions:

– If you’re borrowing (for a house, a car/truck, or a business) is this the best place to get your money? Is there nowhere else in the entire U.S. where you could get a better deal from a broker, a family member, your own savings, or even a small-business / disabled veterans grant?

– If you’re borrowing to pay off consumer debt (credit cards), have you already stopped the behavior that got you into this debt? Or will the lump sum just be a temporary patch on a bigger problem?

– If you’re paying off medical debt, have you consulted a medical-debt counselor for alternate payment plans? Most hospitals will settle for a much smaller sum of money.

Are you borrowing to invest in real estate? Stop now. Browse the BiggerPockets website (and podcasts) to learn better/cheaper ways to get started.

– Are you borrowing to invest? Is this the best interest rate you can get? I’m bullish on the American economy, yet I’m experienced enough to be pessimistic about investing with a margin loan from Interactive Brokers… let alone from DoD.

– Are you borrowing to invest in crypto, online betting, alternatives (metals), startups (angel investing), or a hot tip on the next AI service? Good luck, but I’m happy to discuss angel investing with you if you’re an accredited investor.

 

Pro #2: There are no more pros.

Yes, you might be sensing a theme here.

Whatever you might want to do with a BRS lump sum:  you can do even better by taking your normal monthly BRS pension deposits and investing a portion of that every month instead of “borrowing” at the discount rate.

You’ll also pay lower income taxes and you’ll keep your tax-exempt VA disability compensation.

You might keep your marriage too.

 

Call To Action

If you’re paying off consumer debt, please visit your military base’s family financial support center or emergency relief agency. Review your debt with them and plan your payoff. Most importantly, understand how to avoid incurring that type of debt again.

If you’re going to start a business, get on Linkedin and network with small-business owners. Talk with your local chapter of your Small Business Association. Contact a Veterans Business Outreach Center.  Attend business events like Patriot Bootcamp or Boots to Business.

Use the DoD BRS Calculator to estimate the size of your lump-sum options.

If you expect to have a VA disability rating, use the VA’s disability compensation tables to figure out how much you’re giving up to receive your lump sum.

Talk with your local credit union or community bank to figure out places where you can borrow money at lower interest rates.

Put your numbers into CFP Daniel Kopp’s spreadsheet.

… and please ask more questions or share your story in the comments!

 

 

There are no affiliate links or paid ads in this post.  Try your military base library or local public library before you pay money for these books– in any format.

 

Military Financial Independence on Amazon:

The Military Guide cover
  • Reach your own financial independence
  • Retire on your terms
  • Success stories and personal checklists
  • Royalties donated to military charities

Use this link to order from Amazon.com!

Raising Your Money-Savvy Family on Amazon:

The Money-Savvy Family cover
  • Reach your own financial independence
  • Teach your kids how to manage their money
  • Specific tactics from my adult daughter
  • Checklists and spreadsheets for your family

Use this link to order from Amazon.com!

 

Related articles:
Wise Stewardship Financial Planning’s BRS Lump Sum Calculator
Fear And Despair In The Time Of Bear Markets
“What If The 4% Safe Withdrawal Rate Fails?!?”
In-service Roth Thrift Savings Plan Conversions
Reasons To Keep Your TSP Account (or NOT)
Early Withdrawals From Your TSP and IRA After The Military

 

Posted in Career, Entrepreneurship, Financial Independence, Investing & TSP, Military and Veterans Benefits, Military Life & Family, Military Retirement, Money Management & Personal Finance, Mortgage & Real Estate | Leave a comment

24 Years Of Military Retirement… And Surfing


Yes, this is a website about reaching financial independence with or without the U.S. military– but it’s also a blog about living your financial independence lifestyle.

After that major downer of my post on Alzheimer’s lessons learned, I thought I’d write about a lesson that I’ve taken to heart. (And mind!) Surfing is not just for the challenge and the fun– it’s an essential part of my life for preserving my health and my cognition.

Ironically, I didn’t surf during my 15 years of active duty in Hawaii & California. My spouse and I enjoyed hours of SCUBA diving and snorkeling, but I did not understand surfing’s culture or lifestyle.

There were signs– yet I just wasn’t in the right frame of mind to pay attention.

 

“YOU Might Just Be A… Ready To Surf”

1988 photo of Doug Nordman at a beach in Monterey CA, wearing full SCUBA gear (including a 5mm neoprene wetsuit) for a Rescue Diver course. | MilitaryFinancialIndependence.com

5mm of neoprene… still hypothermic.

In our first California duty station, we learned to dive Monterey Bay. We bought used gear from dozens of military families who’d learned to dive in Hawaii but didn’t want to experience Monterey’s cold water. Those same families were also selling dozens of surfboards from Hawaii— but now they couldn’t imagine having to wear neoprene in the bay’s Asilomar surf break.

A few years later when we were stationed in San Diego, I used to gaze down from an office window (on the peak of Point Loma) at the crowded lineup bobbing in the swells on the Pacific side. (Wearing 2-3mm of neoprene.) A few of those people were shipmates who surfed during their lunch breaks.

At one of my Hawaii commands, a shipmate took leave explicitly for a large and sustained swell working its way up (from the Tasman Sea’s winter storms) to Oahu’s summer south shore. He read the surf forecast every morning and he planned ahead. He was going to surf every day of that swell (unlike California, no neoprene needed in summer!), and he didn’t want minor distractions like paid employment or watchbills to mess with his priorities.

At another Oahu command, a shipmate had surfed for most of his life. At work, he frequently complained about the choice between (1) giving up an hour of sleep for dawn patrol before heading to work, or (2) sleeping in before having to commute past his favorite break, forced to see how awesome the surf would have been if he’d made the time for it.

Even when we were surrounded by surf culture– I just wasn’t ready. I remember hanging out on White Plains Beach during a family weekend, watching our daughter play in the shorebreak while we parents relaxed on the sand and talked about our life after Navy.  The beach was jam-packed solid with crowds, longboards, short boards, and boogie boards. People were even setting up their cameras with long zoom lenses on tripods. In retrospect, the surf that day was at least 6-8 feet.

I didn’t realize the same would happen even at small beaches with lava-rock outcrops.

 

Why Yes, Yes You Can Surf All Day.

My surfing awareness finally dawned in late 2001 when my military retirement request was approved. I started working through my retirement checklist, and the word spread that our family planned to stay in Hawaii. Most of my well-meaning military network felt that my retirement plan was a mistake in a terrible Oahu job market. (“Do you want to work at Pearl Harbor shipyard or Hawaiian Electric Company??”)  The most vocal shipmates were also the furthest from their own financial independence.

In their experience (not much), I should do a nation-wide career search and then move wherever the bridge career was.  Maybe with a real job (I already had the haircut) I could earn enough real money to retire.

Besides, what was I going to do with my retired life on a small island? Surf all day?

I belatedly realized that these people hadn’t figured out their financial independence yet. (Let alone decided to reach it during military service.) Yet they made a good point about surfing all day– and now I had the time to explore that activity after FI!

On the first day of my retirement, we took a family lesson at the Fenceline break of White Plains Beachand 24 years later I still line up at that spot.

These days, when we’re not traveling the world then I paddle out 2-3 times per week. (If we’re staycationing at a beach cabin then I’ll paddle out every day for dawn patrol and sunset surf. Usually both.) Even if there’s not at least 1-3 feet for a longboard on the North Shore (winter) or the south shore (summer), I’ll still paddle out on my stand-up paddleboard.

I’ll paddle something out on the ocean for the rest of my life. About the only thing keeping me out of the water is sustained winds of over 20 knots. Maybe for windy days I should learn to windsurf, kite surf, or foil surf.

People frequently ask me about learning to surf– especially in Hawaii. Just over 20 years ago I started showing friends how to paddle into waves, and I might have mentioned it on a few podcasts over the decades. *

Of course Waikiki is the most popular place on Oahu for surfing lessons. If you’re staying there then take a look at the beach concession behind the Outrigger Reef (by Fort Derussy Beach Park) or at Hilton Hawaiian Village.  Military families can talk with the activities desks at the Hale Koa Hotel or set up a surf lesson from the lifeguards at White Plains Beach on Kalaeloa.

I’ve also watched the North Shore’s surf instructors (for decades!) up at Pua’ena Point Beach Park.

During winters, Pua’ena has three distinct breaks with sizes from “never surfed before” (on the inside) all the way up to the impactful “at least double overhead” outside break. (Northwest swells are particularly good at Pua’ena.) During summers there’s usually still a small break close to the beach, and the trucks & vans of North Shore Surf Girls and Uncle Bryan are there every day.

Image of business card of Hawaii Waves Surf School with "Feel The Wave" tagline and "Ask For Ash!" instructor phone number 808-256-7226. | MilitaryFinancialIndependence.com

New happy surfers… every day.

As I paddle out there, I also enjoy watching Ash teaching new surfers. Last weekend I finally got his contact info (see the photos): HISurfSchool.com and 808-256-7226. He’s one of the best instructors I’ve seen (and I’ve seen a lot of them) and he’s also fun to watch. When I pass his new surfers on the inner break, you can practically feel the stoke radiating off of them… or maybe they’re just enjoying my usual goofy grin.

My high point of a January weekend swell was watching Ash coach an older guy who clearly knows how to paddle but who might have been out of the waves for a few years. I had a great session with friends & family, and even more: I enjoyed watching Ash work with him.Image of business card of Hawaii Waves Surf School with "Feel The Wave" tagline and "Ask For Ash!" instructor phone number 808-256-7226. Group or private lessons at all skill levels. | MilitaryFinancialIndependence.com

* (I’m happy to paddle out with you if you’re already a surfer!  My favorite summer break, White Plains Beach on Kalaeloa, is Navy property.  Their lifeguards run the surf instruction program.)

 

A Different Call To Action

Where will your financial independence take you?

What will you do on your first day after quitting paid employment? A month after? Six months later?

What possibilities are around you now, worth exploring today even if you’re still pursuing FI?

 

 

 

There are no affiliate links or paid ads in this post.  Try your military base library or local public library before you pay money for these books– in any format.

 

Military Financial Independence on Amazon:

The Military Guide cover
  • Reach your own financial independence
  • Retire on your terms
  • Success stories and personal checklists
  • Royalties donated to military charities

Use this link to order from Amazon.com!

Raising Your Money-Savvy Family on Amazon:

The Money-Savvy Family cover
  • Reach your own financial independence
  • Teach your kids how to manage their money
  • Specific tactics from my adult daughter
  • Checklists and spreadsheets for your family

Use this link to order from Amazon.com!

 

Related articles:
All of our podcast appearances since 2013.
Lifestyles in Military Retirement: Surfing Photos
Lifestyles in Military Retirement: Learning to Surf in Hawaii
Lifestyles in Military Retirement: Surfing
21.5 Years Of Financial Independence and Early Retirement
20 Years Of Financial Independence & Military Retirement

Posted in Financial Independence, Military Life & Family, What Do You DO All Day?!? | 2 Comments

Your Millionaire Interview


Since you’re reading this post on a blog about military financial independence, here’s a question for you: have you ever thought about drafting your Millionaire Interview on ESIMoney?

Simply thinking through a series of interview questions (while telling your story) is a compelling exercise. Maybe you’d even want to publish your stories on the site– anonymously. “Publishing” on that site is part of the reason I’ve written this post, but the introspection seems far more valuable to the writer than to their audience. Maybe you don’t need to share it in the first place, let alone publish it.

If you’re a millionaire, then how did you get there? What do you do all day? What will you do next? What advice do you have for future millionaires?

If you’re not (yet) a millionaire, then how will you get there? What are your obstacles and your plans? What questions are you figuring out?

 

My Millionaire Interview Backstory…

I wrote my interview after years of ‘getting around to it’. The questions were an incredibly valuable self-audit experience which forced me to think about what we’d done.  They also forced me to reflect on our oversights and our flat-out mistakes. I felt obligated to share timelines and numbers, and to back up my assertions by showing our math.

After I drafted my responses (to about 40 questions) I handed a printout to my supervising editor (my spouse) for us to discuss. Her first sentence of feedback: “Boooooring!”  And even worse, she’d been there for the whole journey.

Pro tip: an interview is supposed to share stories while educating the audience. It’s not a short-answers essay for clicks & advertising revenue.

My second draft took a good bit more effort than my first, but it was way more interesting– and probably more useful for an audience. In other news, my spouse and I have continued our discussion for years. We’ll be working through those questions for the rest of our lives.

 

… And The Millionaire Money Mentors Forum

Image of the Mr. Monopoly Millionaire character cosplay greeting attendees at a Comic Con | MilitaryFinancialIndependence.com

“Please join us!”

Ironically, I wrote my Millionaire Interview after joining the Millionaire Money Mentors forum.

I was skeptical about joining the forum.  “Who pays money for that?!?” I was sure that I could get better advice from thousands of free Internet sites. In fact, I was already online three decades earlier when The Motley Fool website inadvertently jumpstarted the 1990s financial independence blogging industry (including John Greaney among others) by trying to charge money for their Retire Early forum. Tens of thousands of people ditched TMF to build their own communities instead of further enriching the Gardner brothers.

I recognize what some of us are already thinking:

“But Nords… the Millionaire Interview site owner charges hundreds of dollars for people to join his forum! Of course he wants more people to write their free interviews. It’s how he became a millionaire!!”

You’d hate to get suckered into handing our money to a millionaire– only to learn that he became one by charging $500 each from 2000 people. Per year.

I completely understand the reflex. In reality, he earned his money from a corporate career which happened to include a couple decades of blogging as a side hobby. (“20 years to an overnight success.”) He’s a millionaire from his saving & investing, not from our forum membership fees. I’m pretty sure that most of the revenue goes right back into the monthly payments for the forum software and the hosting bandwidth. It’s one of the fastest and most uptime forums I’ve ever used.

Five years ago when I joined the forum, I also had insider knowledge from years of reading ESIMoney’s first successful site (Free Money Finance).  Later I’d met John at FinCons, and I enjoyed watching his management of Rockstar Finance during its glory days. The forum admin, Steve (founder of ThinkSaveRetire), also has a great reputation for creating websites & content.

Yet the fact is that– even as a submarine veteran– I had to resort to taunting myself into joining the Millionaire Money Mentors forum. After all, I could certainly afford the experiment and I might get a good blog post out of it. If I didn’t like the experience, then I’d still get full value for the price I paid to learn from it.

Thankfully, within days of spending my money I realized the true value of a paid forum: no advertising, no spam, no haters, and no trolls. Just dozens of people who’d become millionaires through various combinations of earning, saving, and investing– and who were now sharing their peer-tutoring experience in a polite and professional environment. Along with photos of their pets.

I started writing my interview in late 2020, a few weeks after joining the forum. I was already feeling introspective because my spouse and I had recently become rookie grandparents. In addition, billions of our fellow humans were grappling with our own mortality in the throes of a global pandemic.

More importantly, the writing redirected my thoughts to where my spouse and I were going with our wealth.

Our daughter (a rookie parent) and I had just published our book, too, so the interview questions made our entire family reflect on our legacy, philanthropy, estate planning, and next-generation FI. Unsurprisingly, the MMM forum is filled with long and detailed threads on those topics.

 

Your Millionaire Interview Opportunity

John & Steve don’t need anyone’s help with the millionaire forum or ESIMoney, but they have a goal: 500 Millionaire Interviews.  As of this post’s publication, they’ve just released MI 461.

Ironically, over the last decade ESIMoney has already had several thousand people ask him to send them the interview questions. Sadly his response rate has consistently hovered around 10%. Getting to MI 500 is going to take nearly 400 more inquiries, but fortunately John has decades of sales experience and knows how to motivate customers.

Here’s his latest offer, quoted directly from his site:

“Anyone who completes a millionaire interview becomes eligible to apply as a mentor in the Millionaire Money Mentors (MMM) forums — and receive free access — by following these steps:
– Complete a millionaire interview on ESI Money.
– Agree to introduce yourself in the forums.
– Agree to minimum posting requirements (because we want active mentors, not passive observers).”

You can read more about that free access at ESIMoney’s “Help Us Reach 500 Millionaire Interviews.”

As an unintended consequence accidental bonus of your free forum mentorship, you get extensive access to the explicit personal details of three generations of Ohana Nords (and our personal wealth-management tactics) that I’ve never shared on any public site. I’m one of the more active members of the Millionaire Money Mentors forum (far more than my participation in any other forums or Facebook groups) but I’m learning more alongside hundreds of other millionaires.

When you search ESIMoney for keywords like “Nords” and “submarine”, you’ll find my Millionaire Interview… as well as a few updates and a handful of sea stories financial posts with a military theme.

 

“Um, Nords, I’m Not A Millionaire Yet…”

If you’re not already a millionaire then you’re still going to be one someday from compounding, right? Maybe it seems exceptionally difficult right now because you’re already earning, saving, & investing– especially when you’re in the boring middle of the financial independence journey. You’re not in the Two-Comma Club yet, but the boring part means it’s working.

Believe it or not, a few members of the forum are from military families– active duty as well as Reserves, National Guard, retirees, and veterans. Military families are present in the same percentages of the forum membership as the rest of America’s military demographics. We shouldn’t be surprised that veterans (with or without military pensions) have figured out how to build millionaire wealth.

I’m not going to suggest that you spend hundreds of dollars on joining the forum as a member. It’s not currently open to paid membership, and I’m not sure whether it’s ever going to reopen for any price.

But you can still read the Millionaire Interviews on ESIMoney. You can still copy & paste the questions from the latest interviews and put the effort into drafting your own interview. (It’s straightforward– and it’s valuable– but it is not easy.) We can contact me here to talk about your path to financial independence, in the comments or in your own guest post.

Read a Millionaire Interview (or two) every week, and keep learning. Your financial wisdom will compound even more quickly than your financial investments.

 

 

 

 

There are no affiliate links or paid ads in this post.  Try your military base library or local public library before you pay money for these books– in any format.

 

Military Financial Independence on Amazon:

The Military Guide cover
  • Reach your own financial independence
  • Retire on your terms
  • Success stories and personal checklists
  • Royalties donated to military charities

Use this link to order from Amazon.com!

Raising Your Money-Savvy Family on Amazon:

The Money-Savvy Family cover
  • Reach your own financial independence
  • Teach your kids how to manage their money
  • Specific tactics from my adult daughter
  • Checklists and spreadsheets for your family

Use this link to order from Amazon.com!

 

Related articles:
“Hey, Nords: How’s Your Net Worth?!?”
“But Nords, You Have A Pension!”
20 Years Of Financial Independence & Military Retirement
Fear And The Just One More Year Syndrome

Posted in Financial Independence, Military Life & Family, Money Management & Personal Finance, Sea Stories | 1 Comment